Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System

["Bruce Plecan" <nacelp@bright.net>]

| Can you replace the module with the msd with the electronic distributor
and
| still have electronic timing control with the ecm?

No, you can triggger a MSD with an electronic dissy, but the dissy needs to
have Vac/mech..
Grumpy

| Subject: RE: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
|
|
| >Like bruce said try the module.  In the dizzy  For some reason the
modules
| >seem to fry in the dissy with msd and all the time with cranes..
acltully
| >with the msd you can rip out the module and hook the msd straight to the
| >pickup.  Msd also offers a conversion cap to make large dizzys ext coil.
| >Mike Rolica
| >Meridian Magnesium Products
| >Strathroy, Ont
| >Ext. 260
| >
| >
| > -----Original Message-----
| > From: Mark Romans [SMTP:romans@pacbell.net]
| > Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 12:39 AM
| > To: gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
| > Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| >
| > I've got a MSD6AL, with Accell coil in cap. MSD box is hidden under
| >the
| > battery box.
| > It stalled on me 3x today.  All at idle or on deceleration.
| >Restarts fine.
| > Mark
| > -----Original Message-----
| > From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
| > To: gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
| ><gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>
| > Date: Monday, January 10, 2000 9:36 PM
| > Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| >
| >
| > >Ahh, get a MSD low resistance center bushing, and a good
| >aftermarket coil.
| > >MSD makes a kit for using a remote coil.
| > >  Better yet get a late model small cap distributor, and use a good
| >coil
| > >with that.
| > >Then might even use a good spark box.
| > >  I know not oem looking then, but worth it, IMHO.
| > >Using a remote coil late dissy, I have 230K miles on the original
| > >module........
| > >Grmpy
| > >
| > >
| > >
| > >| Sorry Bruce:  Forgot to answer, large cap dizzy!
| > >| Mark
| > >| -----Original Message-----
| > >| From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
| > >| To: gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
| ><gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>
| > >| Date: Sunday, January 09, 2000 6:51 PM
| > >| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| > >|
| > >|
| > >| >
| > >| >It usually makes the engine surge wildly, when it applies, on
| >modified
| > >| >engines, even mild surge on stockers.
| > >| >  The mechanics are opening IAC, and adding fuel.  If bad enough
| >I think
| > >it
| > >| >might move the timing.
| > >| >Grumpy
| > >| >  You might just for grins try uping the BL to a higher number
| >for the
| > >idle
| > >| >stall thing.
| > >| >
| > >| >
| > >| >| I just rechecked and 700 rpm's for both GDF files, stall1 and
| >stall2.
| > >I
| > >| >| wonder if that has something to do with stall saver rpm's?
| > >| >| Next question, what specifically does stall saver do?
| > >| >| Mark
| > >| >
| > >| >| From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
| > >| >| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| > >| >| >| Hey Bruce: If I disconnect my est connector, should I see
| >the
| > >advance
| > >| >at
| > >| >| >| 2500 rpm?
| > >| >| >Yes
| > >| >| >| I am wondering if this is why I have the idle problem.
| >Remember
| > how
| > >| >the
| > >| >| >| signal goes to zero advance?
| > >| >| >As I recall it did that during the stall and it was right at
| >400 rpm,
| > >| >which
| > >| >| >is when the ecm drops out of bypass, and it would read 0 as I
| > >understand
| > >| >| >things.
| > >| >| >The only failure I've personnally had or diagnosed with a gm
| >module
| > is
| > >| >hot
| > >| >| >stalling, and progressing to where the engine needs to cool
| >before it
| > >| >would
| > >| >| >restart.
| > >| >| >BTW, is yours a large or small cap Dissy
| > >| >| >Bruce
| > >| >| >| Mark
| > >| >| >| From: John T. Martin <gmman@eskimo.com>
| > >| >| >| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| > >| >| >| >My  $.02
| > >| >| >| >That is a normal condition, also a test for P/U coil
| >signal
| > >strength.
| > >| >| The
| > >| >| >| >advance is triggered by the P/U coil signal amplitude, not
| >RPM. It
| > >is
| > >| >a
| > >| >| >| back
| > >| >| >| >up as I understand it, but a good test if you suspect a
| >weak
| > magnet
| > >| in
| > >| >| >the
| > >| >| >| >dist. We had a run of K engines with shaft problems a
| >while back
| > >and
| > >| >in
| > >| >| >| >bypass (est disconnected), 2500 rpm the advance was not
| >triggered.
| > >| >Also
| > >| >| >the
| > >| >| >| >weak pick-up signal affects idle quality.
| > >| >| >| >Subject: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
| > >| >| >| >A question:
| > >| >| >| >With timing control connector disconnected (ie. setting
| >timing on
| > a
| > >| >| >| >165-based TPI motor), timing should sit still, which it
| >does for
| > me
| > >| at
| > >| >| >low
| > >| >| >| >RPM. However, when I idle it on up to say 2000 or 2500, it
| >seems
| > to
| > >| >| >advance
| > >| >| >| >like 12 degrees or so, instantaneously, and hold up there
| >until I
| > >| idle
| > >| >| it
| > >| >| >| >back down. Then it jump-returns to the previous value.
| >This is all
| > >| >| >| >timing-light based. Any thoughts on what is being seen?
| >There's
| > >about
| > >| >a
| > >| >| >1-3
| > >| >| >| >degree drift on idle-up, probably from timing chain
| >stretch, but
| > >| >that's
| > >| >| >not
| > >| >| >| >huge.
| > >| >| >| >Anyways, fishing for thoughts. It's not problematic, just
| >would
| > >like
| > >| >to
| > >| >| >| >understand what's happening and why.
| > >| >| >| >Sincerely,
| > >| >| >| >Craig
| > >| >
| > >| >
| > >|
| > >
| >
|