Re: Im going CRAZY, WOT tuning is being a bastard! Running outoffuel

[Gabe <gellett@earthlink.net>]

I can vouch for that.  I was having loads of trouble tuning in my Vette with an
Electromotive system until I turned off closed loop.  Once forced to stay in
open loop I was no longer fighting the ECM and was able to make and track
changes that actually made a difference in the right direction.

Now I need to do the same thing to my TPI truck project, just need to get more
EPROMS or an eraser :)

Trying to tune in closed loop, a person will spend a lot of time chasing their
tail, at least I did.

Gabe

Mike Rolica wrote:

> I was once at a site that had a lot of info on this subject.
> Also for me in my 165 now 730 tpi in an s15 ecm, had the same problem while
> going to the track.
> when the car was in limp mode from disconnecting the maf, it ran consistant
> but slower.  When i transfered over to the 730, it too had the same problem.
> Bruce suggested i disable closed loop and run in open and tune it until it
> was bang on.
> when forced in open i ran consistant times that were as fast as my first
> times.  thru tuning i eventually droped .5 sec of the et.
> now i'm working on closed loop  but have not been to the track to test the
> latest bin.. will be tomorrow though.
> you should also mount a fuel pres guage that you can see while driving  as
> close to the injectors as possible.
>
> my 5cents worth canadian (2 cents american :)
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: olbap [SMTP:olbap@mail.mia.bellsouth.net]
> > Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 12:43 PM
> > To:   gmecm@diy-efi.org
> > Subject:      Re: Im going CRAZY, WOT tuning is being a bastard! Running
> > outoffuel
> >
> >
> > It runs strongest at about .9v, currently thats dropping down to very low
> > .8's and high .7s wot.. it runs absolutely horrible too, and im getting
> > pretty bad knock when it happens.
> >
> > The more I think about it the more im starting to think heat is causing
> > it.
> > Not coolant temperature but just some automotive component heat soaking.
> > The reason I believe this is because the last time I went to the track, it
> > did the same thing. I issumed it was bad injectors because the track is
> > 150
> > miles away. I figured the ecm would have learned pretty much all there was
> > to learn. I ran my fastest time on my first run, each run was
> > progressively
> > slower and slower and when i finally decided to look at my O2 it was down
> > at
> > .4 - .5 wot at the end of the night!
> > Yes, i have kept copies of each bin as i go and have taken mental notes.
> > As
> > I said before, i think my part throttle is very close to being right.
> >
> > Pablo
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > At 08:08 AM 5/25/00 EDT, you wrote:
> > >Pablo,
> > >you didn't say what your O2 readings are.  When chip tuning, always
> > >take notes, and keep copies of each bin as you go, so you can "go back".
> > >If you think the ECM's learning curve is fighting you, kill the power
> > >to the ECM and make another test run.. You didn't mention what you
> > >are using to gather data, but I would think the integrator numbers should
> > >help you tun the fuel...
> > >MV
> > >
> > >>
> > >>  I start tuning WOT this morning, friend (or shall i say carbureted
> > arch
> > >>  nemesis) comes by, first chip it runs very strong.. lean past  4200
> > but
> > >very
> > >>  strong nonetheless,  he thinks  i might give him a run finally... he
> > leaves
> > >>  afterwards.
> > >>
> > >>  So, I go into my AFR- WOT table.. drop it down some at 4800
> > >>
> > >>  Go for a spin again.. runs much better.. still lean a bit on top
> > >>
> > >>  Repeat step two
> > >>
> > >>  Go for spin again, seems like maybe (this is a shot inthe dark)
> > perhaps my
> > >>  part throttle isnt as good as i thought, on therich side, and the ecm
> > is
> > >>  leaning me out across the board
> > >>
> > >>  Ok, ill just keep richening it up till its beyond the scope of
> > adjustment i
> > >>  figure (yeah im real half assed about things, i just want it to be
> > fast at
> > >>  wot at this point)
> > >>
> > >>  Repeat step two.. several times
> > >>
> > >>  repeat thepart about me going lean several times.. yet getting worse
> > >>  andworse each time... down to about 3800 rpms its pretty much done.
> > >>
> > >>  Ok, time to go crazy, so i start making big changes in the AFR and FL2
> > just
> > >>  to make it  bird killing, rear bumper blackening, plug fouling rich
> > (id
> > >>  rather work down than up)
> > >>
> > >>  ok, it only makes itBARELY better than what it was
> > >>
> > >>  at this point, i think a geo metro can beat me
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>  desperate times call for desperate measures so i repeat the bird
> > killing,
> > >>  plug fouling step
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