From ebuckler at icehouse.net Tue Jul 3 00:50:35 2007 From: ebuckler at icehouse.net (Ernest Buckler) Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 22:50:35 -0700 Subject: [Bulk] [Diy_efi] Steve Ravat, CX 500 EFI? Message-ID: <01f201c7bd36$13c54ed0$0300a8c0@userc276844d8d> Hello, Going thru old emails, wondering if anyone can tell me whether there's been any progress on availability of EFI for the CX500Turbo Hondas? There was some talk about this a year or so ago, I've lost track, need to keep after this, as Honda no longer supports these great old machines. Ernest Buckler Spokane From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Wed Jul 4 03:48:44 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 01:48:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? Message-ID: <895981.18323.qm@web50311.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I was pointed to this list from the V6 J-body list. I have a 1986 Cadillac Cimarron with the digital instrument panel. It developed a bunch of problems suddenly (trip meter quit, displays intermittent, english/metric switch stuck on english) so I sent it off to the only place I could find that would work on this particular panel. A bit later the tech there calls and said it's all fixed except the odometer. When he first powered it up it displayed all zeroes, a common problem. (Just before I sent it off, I hooked it up to check the miles and it read 96480.) After he did the repairs, the odometer read ERROR. He tried the NVRAM chip from the Cimarron cluster he has that he's been cannibalizing parts from and it too said ERROR. Says he can't get those chips, that particular one was only used in the Cimarron. Going through a GM dealer to have AC Delco refurbish my already refurbished panel (and have the NVRAM chip replaced) would cost me $300! AC Delco does not sell just the chips, repair or exchange of the whole panel only. The service manual for this car says the odometer will read up to 200000 miles then will display FULL. Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof* at only 96,480 miles. The panel is still in transit by UPS back to me, so I can't get numbers off the chip yet. Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement and a way to set the miles to match the original. I'll be keeping mileage logs until I can get the odometer fixed! ____________________________________________________________________________________ Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit. http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097 From ssealander at Stny.rr.com Wed Jul 4 11:51:33 2007 From: ssealander at Stny.rr.com (Scot Sealander) Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 12:51:33 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <895981.18323.qm@web50311.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200707041651.l64GpWso022699@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> I am not sure if you are asking a question or just stating your experience. > Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof* > at only 96,480 miles. Well, a 21 year old electronics part starting acting funny? Seems to me to be fairly reliable! I would offer a guess that maybe the solder was fractured somewhere. There is also the possibility that the EEPROM has just been written to too many times. > Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement > and a way to set the miles to match the original. Sure, but if it was easy to reset the mileage, we would have lots of low-mileage used cars around. I think GM kept this part quiet for a reason. Do you know what the NVRAM part is? There is a good chance that it is a house marked EEPROM that could be replaced, if it is still available. Scot -----Original Message----- From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of Gregg Eshelman Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 4:49 AM To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? I was pointed to this list from the V6 J-body list. I have a 1986 Cadillac Cimarron with the digital instrument panel. It developed a bunch of problems suddenly (trip meter quit, displays intermittent, english/metric switch stuck on english) so I sent it off to the only place I could find that would work on this particular panel. A bit later the tech there calls and said it's all fixed except the odometer. When he first powered it up it displayed all zeroes, a common problem. (Just before I sent it off, I hooked it up to check the miles and it read 96480.) After he did the repairs, the odometer read ERROR. He tried the NVRAM chip from the Cimarron cluster he has that he's been cannibalizing parts from and it too said ERROR. Says he can't get those chips, that particular one was only used in the Cimarron. Going through a GM dealer to have AC Delco refurbish my already refurbished panel (and have the NVRAM chip replaced) would cost me $300! AC Delco does not sell just the chips, repair or exchange of the whole panel only. The service manual for this car says the odometer will read up to 200000 miles then will display FULL. Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof* at only 96,480 miles. The panel is still in transit by UPS back to me, so I can't get numbers off the chip yet. Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement and a way to set the miles to match the original. I'll be keeping mileage logs until I can get the odometer fixed! From steve at donegan.org Wed Jul 4 11:59:39 2007 From: steve at donegan.org (Steven P. Donegan) Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 09:59:39 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <200707041651.l64GpWso022699@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> References: <200707041651.l64GpWso022699@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1183568379.18861.32.camel@wopr.donegan.org> My gut instinct says pay GM for the refurb - I think any other path will take longer and cost more in the end... On Wed, 2007-07-04 at 12:51 -0400, Scot Sealander wrote: > I am not sure if you are asking a question or just stating your experience. > > > Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof* > > at only 96,480 miles. > > Well, a 21 year old electronics part starting acting funny? Seems to me to > be fairly reliable! I would offer a guess that maybe the solder was > fractured somewhere. There is also the possibility that the EEPROM has just > been written to too many times. > > > > Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement > > and a way to set the miles to match the original. > > Sure, but if it was easy to reset the mileage, we would have lots of > low-mileage used cars around. I think GM kept this part quiet for a reason. > Do you know what the NVRAM part is? There is a good chance that it is a > house marked EEPROM that could be replaced, if it is still available. > > Scot > > -----Original Message----- > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On > Behalf Of Gregg Eshelman > Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 4:49 AM > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? > > I was pointed to this list from the V6 J-body list. > > I have a 1986 Cadillac Cimarron with the digital > instrument panel. It developed a bunch of problems > suddenly (trip meter quit, displays intermittent, > english/metric switch stuck on english) so I sent it > off to the only place I could find that would work > on this particular panel. > > A bit later the tech there calls and said it's all > fixed except the odometer. When he first powered it > up it displayed all zeroes, a common problem. (Just > before I sent it off, I hooked it up to check the > miles and it read 96480.) After he did the repairs, > the odometer read ERROR. He tried the NVRAM chip > from the Cimarron cluster he has that he's been > cannibalizing parts from and it too said ERROR. > > Says he can't get those chips, that particular one > was only used in the Cimarron. Going through a GM > dealer to have AC Delco refurbish my already > refurbished panel (and have the NVRAM chip replaced) > would cost me $300! AC Delco does not sell just the > chips, repair or exchange of the whole panel only. > > The service manual for this car says the odometer > will read up to 200000 miles then will display FULL. > > Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof* > at only 96,480 miles. > > The panel is still in transit by UPS back to me, so > I can't get numbers off the chip yet. > > Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement > and a way to set the miles to match the original. > I'll be keeping mileage logs until I can get the > odometer fixed! > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From buckwill33 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 4 12:06:11 2007 From: buckwill33 at hotmail.com (Buck Williams) Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 11:06:11 -0600 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? Message-ID: isss your tech in wiscaonsin,,,, if not i can senddd u name of man was refurb techhhh for gm now refaurbv in his own businesss , i founddd his name for fraiend who neededdd digiatal dash for s10, buck > Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 01:48:44 -0700> From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com> To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org> Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer?> > I was pointed to this list from the V6 J-body list.> > I have a 1986 Cadillac Cimarron with the digital> instrument panel. It developed a bunch of problems> suddenly (trip meter quit, displays intermittent,> english/metric switch stuck on english) so I sent it> off to the only place I could find that would work> on this particular panel.> > A bit later the tech there calls and said it's all> fixed except the odometer. When he first powered it> up it displayed all zeroes, a common problem. (Just> before I sent it off, I hooked it up to check the> miles and it read 96480.) After he did the repairs,> the odometer read ERROR. He tried the NVRAM chip> from the Cimarron cluster he has that he's been> cannibalizing parts from and it too said ERROR.> > Says he can't get those chips, that particular one> was only used in the Cimarron. Going through a GM> dealer to have AC Delco refurbish my already> refurbished panel (and have the NVRAM chip replaced)> would cost me $300! AC Delco does not sell just the> chips, repair or exchange of the whole panel only.> > The service manual for this car says the odometer> will read up to 200000 miles then will display FULL.> > Not so hot reliability for the panel to go *poof*> at only 96,480 miles.> > The panel is still in transit by UPS back to me, so> I can't get numbers off the chip yet.> > Would be nice to find a reasonably priced replacement> and a way to set the miles to match the original.> I'll be keeping mileage logs until I can get the> odometer fixed!> > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________> Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels> in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.> http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097> _______________________________________________> Diy_efi mailing list> Diy_efi at diy-efi.org> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Wed Jul 4 14:43:45 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 12:43:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <683881.77237.qm@web50305.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Buck Williams wrote: > isss your tech in wiscaonsin,,,, if not i can senddd > u name of man was refurb techhhh for gm now refaurbv > in his own businesss , i founddd his name for > fraiend who neededdd digiatal dash for s10, buck I sent it to Mr. Whizard, his website says North Dakota but he's actually in Canada. The shipping address in Pembina is just a drop box then he runs cross the border to pick up and ship. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel. http://travel.yahoo.com/ From davita at gimail.af.mil Thu Jul 5 13:13:19 2007 From: davita at gimail.af.mil (davita at gimail.af.mil) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 14:13:19 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] Harley Davidson ECM Programming Message-ID: <12809ad94fec4c9b930b5ceae75bd6a1.davita@gimail.af.mil> Hello, I'm new to the list and have a question about reprogramming Harley Davidson ECMs. Does anyone know of a way to either program the ECM without the factory software/SERT or unlock the factory SERT? Any help for this newbie would be appreciated. Tony From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Thu Jul 5 13:34:06 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 11:34:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <200707041651.l64GpWso022699@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: <71443.46021.qm@web50309.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Scot Sealander wrote: > > I am not sure if you are asking a question or just > stating your experience. Both. :) I got the dash back, here's a picture of the chip. http://members.aceweb.com/gregg1/nvram.jpg I had to scrape brown glue off the chip after removing it from its plastic carrier frame. Is the GI for General Instruments? It's not a Yazaki part, it'd have the Yazaki logo on it like the other chips do if it was. ____________________________________________________________________________________ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ From b.shaw at comcast.net Thu Jul 5 13:40:16 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2007 14:40:16 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <71443.46021.qm@web50309.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <71443.46021.qm@web50309.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <468D3B10.902@comcast.net> Yep, looks like General Instruments. Bill Gregg Eshelman wrote: > --- Scot Sealander wrote: > >> I am not sure if you are asking a question or just >> stating your experience. >> > > Both. :) > > I got the dash back, here's a picture of the chip. > > http://members.aceweb.com/gregg1/nvram.jpg > > I had to scrape brown glue off the chip after removing > it from its plastic carrier frame. > > Is the GI for General Instruments? It's not a Yazaki > part, it'd have the Yazaki logo on it like the other > chips do if it was. > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > It's here! Your new message! > Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > From jsnord at hotmail.com Thu Jul 5 15:35:16 2007 From: jsnord at hotmail.com (JS Nord) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 13:35:16 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] Mass Air Flow and air temperature correcting Message-ID: Can anyone point me to some information that outlines how a hot wire type MAF sensor is impacted by air temperature changes? I have a Pro-M racing MAF conversion (Ford MAF unit) on my BWM 535i (running motronic 1.3). Factory setup is a vane type bosch air flow meter with an air intake temp sensor. The Pro-m conversion kit comes with AIT sensor which can be fed to the factory motronic feed. The motronic will adjust fuel pulse and engine timing (retard) based on the AIT reading. Amount of correction is unknown. My wideband O2 sensor is showing my mixture leaning out on hot days when the AIT is connected so I'm assuming it's overcorrecting the fuel. I'm trying to determine if I should just unplug the AIT, run connected or install a resistor/choke to force a certain value to the motronic. (The later seems most preferable at this point). Suggestions or resources? Jeff 90 BMW 535i From ssealander at Stny.rr.com Thu Jul 5 17:05:30 2007 From: ssealander at Stny.rr.com (Scot Sealander) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 18:05:30 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <71443.46021.qm@web50309.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200707052205.l65M5SXL005282@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Looking for the chip turned up nothing specific. This was kind of interesting though. http://www.antiquetech.com/companies/GI.htm Antique tech? It is getting old. Looks like GI did make some EEPROM. Maybe if you could find an old data book it would help. Scot -----Original Message----- From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of Gregg Eshelman Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 2:34 PM To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? --- Scot Sealander wrote: > > I am not sure if you are asking a question or just > stating your experience. Both. :) I got the dash back, here's a picture of the chip. http://members.aceweb.com/gregg1/nvram.jpg I had to scrape brown glue off the chip after removing it from its plastic carrier frame. Is the GI for General Instruments? It's not a Yazaki part, it'd have the Yazaki logo on it like the other chips do if it was. ____________________________________________________________________________ ________ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Fri Jul 6 01:34:15 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 23:34:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <879244.66129.qm@web50304.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Buck Williams wrote: > isss your tech in wiscaonsin,,,, if not i can senddd > u name of man was refurb techhhh for gm now refaurbv > in his own businesss , i founddd his name for > fraiend who neededdd digiatal dash for s10, buck No, Manitoba, Canada. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Get the free Yahoo! toolbar and rest assured with the added security of spyware protection. http://new.toolbar.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/norton/index.php From b.shaw at comcast.net Fri Jul 6 23:04:21 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 00:04:21 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] Re: [Gmecm] The next step: E67 ECM In-Reply-To: <504504.10781.qm@web35902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <504504.10781.qm@web35902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <468F10C5.5050801@comcast.net> Ryan, did you find connectors for this ecm? I bought one also, $60. Could have bought 10 at that price. Bill Ryan Hess wrote: > Yep. Ebay! Although car-part.com had some for $50, I wanted to use > paypal. > > */Bill Shaw /* wrote: > > Ryan, > > Where did you get it for $60? That's used, right? > > Best, > > Bill > > From b.shaw at comcast.net Sat Jul 7 14:20:13 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 15:20:13 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks Message-ID: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> I'm working on a cal for my new 5.0L 928 engine and I'm having some trouble. I've had this basic setup running pretty good for several years and dozens of track days now - Porsche 4.7L V8 with LT1 throttle body, SyTy ecm (1227749) running a max of 9 psi from a Vortech blower. Recently I've 'improved' things - bigger 58 mm throttle body vs stock 48 mm, bigger cams, bigger injectors, extrude honed heads, headers, bigger exhaust. I started with the same bin I ran on the previous motor and dropped bpw vs %egr a bit to compensate for the cumulative engine/injector changes then tweaked F31E base VE vs RPM & Map, and F30 base VE vs RPM to get it to start and idle. It's starting and idling pretty good now, but as soon as I touch the throttle the injector pulse width goes from about 4 ms at idle to about 1.5ms. It spits & pops as long as I keep the throttle open and won't rev past about 2k. As soon as I close the throttle I see the injector pulse width jump to 6 ms or so. I've tried increasing the AE delta throttle and AE delta map tables with no real change. Any ideas why it's shortening the pulse width when I crack the throttle? Where should I look to increase the pulse width? Thanks, Bill From leroy at sunflower.com Sat Jul 7 16:14:23 2007 From: leroy at sunflower.com (Jim Sloan) Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2007 16:14:23 -0500 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks In-Reply-To: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> References: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> Message-ID: <000001c7c0db$cb2db690$6401a8c0@desktop> There needs to be a fairly smooth transition between the closed throttle table (F29E) and the open throttle table (F29). You may need a lot more fuel than you expect off idle. I don't think there is an F31E table. Other than that, you are on the right track tweaking the AE settings, IMO. Jim -----Original Message----- From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of Bill Shaw Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:20 PM To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks I'm working on a cal for my new 5.0L 928 engine and I'm having some trouble. I've had this basic setup running pretty good for several years and dozens of track days now - Porsche 4.7L V8 with LT1 throttle body, SyTy ecm (1227749) running a max of 9 psi from a Vortech blower. Recently I've 'improved' things - bigger 58 mm throttle body vs stock 48 mm, bigger cams, bigger injectors, extrude honed heads, headers, bigger exhaust. I started with the same bin I ran on the previous motor and dropped bpw vs %egr a bit to compensate for the cumulative engine/injector changes then tweaked F31E base VE vs RPM & Map, and F30 base VE vs RPM to get it to start and idle. It's starting and idling pretty good now, but as soon as I touch the throttle the injector pulse width goes from about 4 ms at idle to about 1.5ms. It spits & pops as long as I keep the throttle open and won't rev past about 2k. As soon as I close the throttle I see the injector pulse width jump to 6 ms or so. I've tried increasing the AE delta throttle and AE delta map tables with no real change. Any ideas why it's shortening the pulse width when I crack the throttle? Where should I look to increase the pulse width? Thanks, Bill _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From 9jim30 at charter.net Sat Jul 7 16:44:44 2007 From: 9jim30 at charter.net (James Panter) Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2007 16:44:44 -0500 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks References: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> Message-ID: <001301c7c0e0$0906db00$6501a8c0@COMPY> Bill I've had so much trouble getting my twin turbo to run with a 749 it almost gives me a small bit of pleasure to see one of my mentors have some fruntration!!! Good luck on the tune. Jim Panter ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Shaw" To: Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:20 PM Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks > I'm working on a cal for my new 5.0L 928 engine and I'm having some > trouble. I've had this basic setup running pretty good for several years > and dozens of track days now - Porsche 4.7L V8 with LT1 throttle body, > SyTy ecm (1227749) running a max of 9 psi from a Vortech blower. Recently > I've 'improved' things - bigger 58 mm throttle body vs stock 48 mm, > bigger cams, bigger injectors, extrude honed heads, headers, bigger > exhaust. I started with the same bin I ran on the previous motor and > dropped bpw vs %egr a bit to compensate for the cumulative engine/injector > changes then tweaked F31E base VE vs RPM & Map, and F30 base VE vs RPM to > get it to start and idle. > > It's starting and idling pretty good now, but as soon as I touch the > throttle the injector pulse width goes from about 4 ms at idle to about > 1.5ms. It spits & pops as long as I keep the throttle open and won't rev > past about 2k. As soon as I close the throttle I see the injector pulse > width jump to 6 ms or so. I've tried increasing the AE delta throttle > and AE delta map tables with no real change. Any ideas why it's > shortening the pulse width when I crack the throttle? Where should I look > to increase the pulse width? > > Thanks, > > Bill > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > From steve at donegan.org Sat Jul 7 16:54:01 2007 From: steve at donegan.org (Steven P. Donegan) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 14:54:01 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] Silver State Race? In-Reply-To: <001301c7c0e0$0906db00$6501a8c0@COMPY> References: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> <001301c7c0e0$0906db00$6501a8c0@COMPY> Message-ID: <1183845241.16336.23.camel@wopr.donegan.org> Anyone going to go play in Nevada in September? I've done it 8 times - but haven't done it since 200 so will be a re-birth for me. www.sscc.us From brentmirchandani at msn.com Sat Jul 7 19:05:29 2007 From: brentmirchandani at msn.com (DORENE MIRCHANDANI) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 18:05:29 -0600 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks In-Reply-To: <468FE76D.70202@comcast.net> Message-ID: Bill, It sounds like you are possibly idling in asynchronus mode and it's switching to synchronus mode when you get on the throttle. I can't imagine needing to idle at 4ms pulse widths in synchronous mode injector firing....especially with "bigger injectors". My guess is due to the larger injectors (smaller bpw vs %egr value) it requires a smaller synchronous pulse width than the minimum sychronous base pulse configured(KAPLL). Depending on your injectors, they may or may not be able to reliably fire small pulsewidths. If they can, you can test by setting KAPLL to 0 which will keep you out of async injector firing mode. You can also disable async by setting KQASPRMD to 0 rpm. In my experience, I have not been able to idle in async as the transition to sync in anything but smooth. Hope this helps. Brent >From: Bill Shaw >Reply-To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks >Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 15:20:13 -0400 > >I'm working on a cal for my new 5.0L 928 engine and I'm having some >trouble. I've had this basic setup running pretty good for several years >and dozens of track days now - Porsche 4.7L V8 with LT1 throttle body, SyTy >ecm (1227749) running a max of 9 psi from a Vortech blower. Recently I've >'improved' things - bigger 58 mm throttle body vs stock 48 mm, bigger >cams, bigger injectors, extrude honed heads, headers, bigger exhaust. I >started with the same bin I ran on the previous motor and dropped bpw vs >%egr a bit to compensate for the cumulative engine/injector changes then >tweaked F31E base VE vs RPM & Map, and F30 base VE vs RPM to get it to >start and idle. > >It's starting and idling pretty good now, but as soon as I touch the >throttle the injector pulse width goes from about 4 ms at idle to about >1.5ms. It spits & pops as long as I keep the throttle open and won't rev >past about 2k. As soon as I close the throttle I see the injector pulse >width jump to 6 ms or so. I've tried increasing the AE delta throttle and >AE delta map tables with no real change. Any ideas why it's shortening the >pulse width when I crack the throttle? Where should I look to increase >the pulse width? > >Thanks, > >Bill >_______________________________________________ >Diy_efi mailing list >Diy_efi at diy-efi.org >Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi >Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From espresso_doppio at yahoo.com Sat Jul 7 20:41:52 2007 From: espresso_doppio at yahoo.com (Adam Wade) Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2007 18:41:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] Silver State Race? Message-ID: <284159.59936.qm@web32215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven P. Donegan" To: Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:54 PM Subject: [Diy_efi] Silver State Race? > Anyone going to go play in Nevada in September? I've done it 8 times - > but haven't done it since 200 so will be a re-birth for me. Wow, haven't been there in almost 1800 years, huh? I'll bet things go a lot more quickly with internal combustion engines being the standard now and all. ;) Seriously... I'd love to go and capture some of the personalities that will be there... There must be more than a few "gonzo" folks who might have once claimed to be on the Vincent Black Shadow team. ;) If there was any motorcycle content, I could reasonably get media credentials and soak up the local color. If I wasn't fairly sure that Automobile Magazine would already have someone there, I could try and break into automotive journalism. ;) More of a market than the motorcycle world, I hear tell... And I long to be allowed to write the sort of stuff Ezra Dyer puts out, and that Jamie Kitman used to many moons ago. I should amend that; I write that sort of stuff quite often, but so far there isn't a media outlet in North America that showcases that sort of writing for the motorcycle world. Anyone want to start a new magazine with me? :D I can have a business proposal researched and assembled by the end of the week... Seriously, if you're going, I may make the trek out to enjoy the experience, and to spend some time talking face-to-face about some of the long-term projects we've been discussing. I doubt I can fund much more than gas there and back out of my own pocket, but I should be able to finagle media credentials, and although my stamina ain't what it used to be, I can still spin a mean wrench (I'm a former AMA Superbike trackside race mechanic). Ping me off-list with details and so forth, and I'll see if I can't work something out. It sounds like a blast, and I remember reading about it maybe 5, 6 years ago in Automobile. Wish they'd let me run my motorcycle flat-out with the tall gearing, I've always wanted a straight, long, safe stretch of road to test top speed. With the major motor mods, the bike will pull right past redline in top gear (stock gearing) without much indication that you've gone past "the end of the dial". No bodywork, but with stock gearing, the actual "no compromise" redline hits at about 115-120 mph using stock gearing (16T front, 41T rear). With my taller gearing (17T front, 38T rear), the GPS says I've had it up to an honest 125, with plenty more pull to use, but I ran out of straight, smooth road and my paranoia about handcuffs and watching my bike get smashed up hanging from the strap of a tow truck as it travels to impound judiciously relaxed the twist of my right wrist. ;) Would be a lot of fun to see what I can do for a top speed, as well as finding out if I can raise that even more with another gearing change. ;) | Kawasaki Zephyr 615 (Daphne) 1985 RX-7 GSL-SE (Rex) | | "It was like an emergency ward after a great catastrophe; it | | didn't matter what race or class the victims belonged to. | | They were all given the same miracle drug, which was coffee. | | The catastrophe in this case, of course, was that the sun | | had come up again." -Kurt Vonnegut | | M/C Fuel Inj. Hndbk. @ Amazon.com - http://tinyurl.com/2qxnyu | ____________________________________________________________________________________ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 From steve at donegan.org Sat Jul 7 20:49:49 2007 From: steve at donegan.org (Steven P. Donegan) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 18:49:49 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] Silver State Race? In-Reply-To: <284159.59936.qm@web32215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <284159.59936.qm@web32215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1183859389.16336.60.camel@wopr.donegan.org> Well in order :-) A) you can get press credentials B) It's a hoot in any case :-) So C) If you can make it - very cool :-) I have been so busy on work stuff I have not been able to spedn any time on DIY EFI stuff. When time permits that will change. On the Press credentials thing if you decide to attend let me know - I'm a life member of SSCC and can pull a bit of strings :-) Car I will be running this time (have run Mustang and Camaro in the past) will be a 2007 Nissan 350Z Touring Roadster - with a ton of mods :-) Cheers! On Sat, 2007-07-07 at 18:41 -0700, Adam Wade wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steven P. Donegan" > To: > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:54 PM > Subject: [Diy_efi] Silver State Race? > > > > Anyone going to go play in Nevada in September? I've done it 8 times - > > but haven't done it since 200 so will be a re-birth for me. > > Wow, haven't been there in almost 1800 years, huh? I'll bet things go a > lot > more quickly with internal combustion engines being the standard now and > all. ;) > > Seriously... I'd love to go and capture some of the personalities that > will > be there... There must be more than a few "gonzo" folks who might have > once > claimed to be on the Vincent Black Shadow team. ;) If there was any > motorcycle content, I could reasonably get media credentials and soak up > the > local color. If I wasn't fairly sure that Automobile Magazine would > already > have someone there, I could try and break into automotive journalism. ;) > More of a market than the motorcycle world, I hear tell... And I long to > be > allowed to write the sort of stuff Ezra Dyer puts out, and that Jamie > Kitman > used to many moons ago. I should amend that; I write that sort of stuff > quite often, but so far there isn't a media outlet in North America that > showcases that sort of writing for the motorcycle world. Anyone want to > start a new magazine with me? :D I can have a business proposal > researched > and assembled by the end of the week... > > Seriously, if you're going, I may make the trek out to enjoy the > experience, > and to spend some time talking face-to-face about some of the long-term > projects we've been discussing. I doubt I can fund much more than gas > there > and back out of my own pocket, but I should be able to finagle media > credentials, and although my stamina ain't what it used to be, I can still > spin a mean wrench (I'm a former AMA Superbike trackside race mechanic). > Ping me off-list with details and so forth, and I'll see if I can't work > something out. It sounds like a blast, and I remember reading about it > maybe 5, 6 years ago in Automobile. Wish they'd let me run my motorcycle > flat-out with the tall gearing, I've always wanted a straight, long, safe > stretch of road to test top speed. With the major motor mods, the bike > will > pull right past redline in top gear (stock gearing) without much indication > > that you've gone past "the end of the dial". No bodywork, but with stock > gearing, the actual "no compromise" redline hits at about 115-120 mph using > > stock gearing (16T front, 41T rear). With my taller gearing (17T front, > 38T > rear), the GPS says I've had it up to an honest 125, with plenty more pull > to use, but I ran out of straight, smooth road and my paranoia about > handcuffs and watching my bike get smashed up hanging from the strap of a > tow truck as it travels to impound judiciously relaxed the twist of my > right > wrist. ;) Would be a lot of fun to see what I can do for a top speed, as > well as finding out if I can raise that even more with another gearing > change. ;) > > | Kawasaki Zephyr 615 (Daphne) 1985 RX-7 GSL-SE (Rex) | > | "It was like an emergency ward after a great catastrophe; it | > | didn't matter what race or class the victims belonged to. | > | They were all given the same miracle drug, which was coffee. | > | The catastrophe in this case, of course, was that the sun | > | had come up again." -Kurt Vonnegut | > | M/C Fuel Inj. Hndbk. @ Amazon.com - http://tinyurl.com/2qxnyu | > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From b.shaw at comcast.net Sat Jul 7 20:55:18 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 21:55:18 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <46904406.6090604@comcast.net> My biggest problem this afternoon was from a completely unexpected source, the ignition bypass was open. Once I plugged it in things started behaving much better (Doh!) It ran good enough for me to take it out on the road. Idle and very light throttle are much better, I can accelerate slowly but it goes lean pretty quick once I start opening it up. Still more work to go but definitely an improvement today. Thanks for all the suggestions and input. Bill DORENE MIRCHANDANI wrote: > Bill, > > It sounds like you are possibly idling in asynchronus mode and it's > switching to synchronus mode when you get on the throttle. I can't > imagine needing to idle at 4ms pulse widths in synchronous mode > injector firing....especially with "bigger injectors". My guess is > due to the larger injectors (smaller bpw vs %egr value) it requires a > smaller synchronous pulse width than the minimum sychronous base pulse > configured(KAPLL). > > Depending on your injectors, they may or may not be able to reliably > fire small pulsewidths. If they can, you can test by setting KAPLL to > 0 which will keep you out of async injector firing mode. You can also > disable async by setting KQASPRMD to 0 rpm. In my experience, I have > not been able to idle in async as the transition to sync in anything > but smooth. > > Hope this helps. > > Brent > > >> From: Bill Shaw >> Reply-To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >> To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >> Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 tweaks >> Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 15:20:13 -0400 >> >> I'm working on a cal for my new 5.0L 928 engine and I'm having some >> trouble. I've had this basic setup running pretty good for several >> years and dozens of track days now - Porsche 4.7L V8 with LT1 >> throttle body, SyTy ecm (1227749) running a max of 9 psi from a >> Vortech blower. Recently I've 'improved' things - bigger 58 mm >> throttle body vs stock 48 mm, bigger cams, bigger injectors, extrude >> honed heads, headers, bigger exhaust. I started with the same bin I >> ran on the previous motor and dropped bpw vs %egr a bit to compensate >> for the cumulative engine/injector changes then tweaked F31E base VE >> vs RPM & Map, and F30 base VE vs RPM to get it to start and idle. >> >> It's starting and idling pretty good now, but as soon as I touch the >> throttle the injector pulse width goes from about 4 ms at idle to >> about 1.5ms. It spits & pops as long as I keep the throttle open and >> won't rev past about 2k. As soon as I close the throttle I see the >> injector pulse width jump to 6 ms or so. I've tried increasing the >> AE delta throttle and AE delta map tables with no real change. Any >> ideas why it's shortening the pulse width when I crack the throttle? >> Where should I look to increase the pulse width? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> Diy_efi mailing list >> Diy_efi at diy-efi.org >> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi >> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > From torbjorn.forsman at gengas.nu Tue Jul 10 17:26:33 2007 From: torbjorn.forsman at gengas.nu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Torbj=F6rn_Forsman?=) Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 00:26:33 +0200 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <200707052205.l65M5SXL005282@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> References: <200707052205.l65M5SXL005282@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: <46940799.7030509@gengas.nu> Indeed, GI made some obscure eeproms during the late 70's and 80's. One common type was the ER1400, which was mainly used for saving tuning data in televisions, car radios etc. It has a rudimentary serial interface, definitely not so sophisticated and user-friendly as the SPI/Microwire or I2C interfaces of more recent eeproms. One common (and awkward) thing about old eeproms is that they often use strange supply voltages and logic levels. I am not exactly sure, but i think that the ER1400 needs +5 V, -40 V and possibly one more voltage too. The logic levels are 0 V and -9 V. Best regards Torbj?rn Forsman Scot Sealander wrote: > Looking for the chip turned up nothing specific. This was kind of > interesting though. > > http://www.antiquetech.com/companies/GI.htm > > Antique tech? It is getting old. Looks like GI did make some EEPROM. > Maybe if you could find an old data book it would help. > > Scot > > > -----Original Message----- > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On > Behalf Of Gregg Eshelman > Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 2:34 PM > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? > > --- Scot Sealander wrote: > >>I am not sure if you are asking a question or just >>stating your experience. > > > Both. :) > > I got the dash back, here's a picture of the chip. > > http://members.aceweb.com/gregg1/nvram.jpg > > I had to scrape brown glue off the chip after removing > it from its plastic carrier frame. > > Is the GI for General Instruments? It's not a Yazaki > part, it'd have the Yazaki logo on it like the other > chips do if it was. > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > ________ > It's here! Your new message! > Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > From llemoine at gmail.com Tue Jul 10 21:26:33 2007 From: llemoine at gmail.com (Lee M. Lemoine) Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 21:26:33 -0500 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <46940799.7030509@gengas.nu> References: <200707052205.l65M5SXL005282@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> <46940799.7030509@gengas.nu> Message-ID: Hey there, I used to have a '88 Cavalier Z24 with the digital dash -- while it looks nothing like the cimmaron dash, i'd imagine maybe at least some of the circuitry was electrically similar, as the J-platform shared electronics between 1982-1990ish (they changed everything up when they facelifted the car. Another optional source would be the Beretta, as i know that had a digital option dash. Thats not to say its gonna fix your problem either.. Best of luck! --Lee On 7/10/07, Torbj?rn Forsman wrote: > > Indeed, GI made some obscure eeproms during the late 70's and 80's. One > common type was the ER1400, which was mainly used for saving tuning data > in televisions, car radios etc. It has a rudimentary serial interface, > definitely not so sophisticated and user-friendly as the SPI/Microwire > or I2C interfaces of more recent eeproms. > One common (and awkward) thing about old eeproms is that they often use > strange supply voltages and logic levels. I am not exactly sure, but i > think that the ER1400 needs +5 V, -40 V and possibly one more voltage > too. The logic levels are 0 V and -9 V. > > Best regards > > Torbj?rn Forsman > > Scot Sealander wrote: > > Looking for the chip turned up nothing specific. This was kind of > > interesting though. > > > > http://www.antiquetech.com/companies/GI.htm > > > > Antique tech? It is getting old. Looks like GI did make some EEPROM. > > Maybe if you could find an old data book it would help. > > > > Scot > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] > On > > Behalf Of Gregg Eshelman > > Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 2:34 PM > > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? > > > > --- Scot Sealander wrote: > > > >>I am not sure if you are asking a question or just > >>stating your experience. > > > > > > Both. :) > > > > I got the dash back, here's a picture of the chip. > > > > http://members.aceweb.com/gregg1/nvram.jpg > > > > I had to scrape brown glue off the chip after removing > > it from its plastic carrier frame. > > > > Is the GI for General Instruments? It's not a Yazaki > > part, it'd have the Yazaki logo on it like the other > > chips do if it was. > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > ________ > > It's here! Your new message! > > Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. > > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Diy_efi mailing list > > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Diy_efi mailing list > > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > -- Sincerely, Lee M. Lemoine N3LEE - Amateur Radio /WQGP447 - GMRS HTTP://WWW.N3LEE.COM From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Wed Jul 11 02:33:00 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 00:33:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <46940799.7030509@gengas.nu> Message-ID: <575982.91983.qm@web50305.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Torbj?rn Forsman wrote: > Indeed, GI made some obscure eeproms during the late > 70's and 80's. One > common type was the ER1400, which was mainly used > for saving tuning data > in televisions, car radios etc. It has a rudimentary > serial interface, > definitely not so sophisticated and user-friendly as > the SPI/Microwire > or I2C interfaces of more recent eeproms. > One common (and awkward) thing about old eeproms is > that they often use > strange supply voltages and logic levels. I am not > exactly sure, but i > think that the ER1400 needs +5 V, -40 V and possibly > one more voltage > too. The logic levels are 0 V and -9 V. I've found what seems to be a compatable chip, the Mitsubishi M58653P, and I found it for only $8.99 rather than the almost $90 ripoff price Galco wants for a GI ER1451. http://www.acme-sales.net/acmecart/html/main/portal.php?country=USA&p_id=M58653P ACME doesn't have the GI chip. Comparing datasheets for the two, the only difference seems to be that pin 4 is a ground on the GI chip but is not connected on the Mitsubishi. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097 From wscowell at aol.com Wed Jul 11 05:16:32 2007 From: wscowell at aol.com (wscowell at aol.com) Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 06:16:32 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? In-Reply-To: <575982.91983.qm@web50305.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8C991BBB04DB765-17F4-1BF@WEBMAIL-RA15.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Gregg Eshelman To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Sent: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 8.33am Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] NVRAM chip for a 1986 GM odometer? Don't forget to check the timing diagrams for read, write and similar operations, for compatibility with the earlier part. Electrical compatibility is only half the story. Rgds Will C >I've found what seems to be a compatable chip, the >Mitsubishi M58653P, and I found it for only $8.99 >rather than the almost $90 ripoff price Galco wants >for a GI ER1451. >http://www.acme-sales.net/acmecart/html/main/portal.php?country=USA&p_id=M58653P >ACME doesn't have the GI chip. >Comparing datasheets for the two, the only difference >seems to be that pin 4 is a ground on the GI chip but >is not connected on the Mitsubishi. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097 _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi ________________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE AOL Email account with 2GB of storage. Plus, share and store photos and experience exclusively recorded live music Sessions from your favourite artists. Find out more at http://info.aol.co.uk/joinnow/?ncid=548. From mfrels at ix.netcom.com Wed Jul 11 19:28:14 2007 From: mfrels at ix.netcom.com (Mike Frels) Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 18:28:14 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [Diy_efi] Warm start problem... Message-ID: <29180054.1184200095220.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I am trying to diagnose a hot or warm start problem. I've got a gm TPI 350 running $8D for a 305 that has been modded to work with my setup. Morning starts she fires right up. Hot starts if she's only been sitting for less than 10-15 minutes also fine. A restart between 15 minutes to 5 hours sitting takes some cranking. Looking through my tables I've got various Start Up Enrichment and Crank Fuel Pulse Width settings that I am thinking I need to adjust. Can someone enlighten me on what the differences between Start Up Enrichment and Crank Fuel Pulse Width? BTW I have acquired this summer time problem since I switched to LS1 injectors last year. Mike From dunvegan at sbcglobal.net Thu Jul 12 08:33:11 2007 From: dunvegan at sbcglobal.net (Rick McLeod) Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 06:33:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] Re: [Gmecm] Warm start problem... Message-ID: <985155.15220.qm@web80507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I've always been a proponent of only making one change at a time, so now tweaking would be a second, and it's broken. Are you sure the injectors match, or do you know they really need tweaks in code to make them behave like OEM? I'd make sure/verify that the problem is the injectors, and not due to something else being 'broken' before trying to tweak. This behaviour sounds more like an errant sensor rather than the injectors, assuming all else is in order, meaning it's running closed loop within the correct adjustment state. If it's not and the computer is having to adjust radically for the new injecors to maintain closed loop, then that warrants tweaking, but start there first (IMHO) and if you get all that correct, then I'd bet a cup of coffee that the start condition begins to behave. hth, cheers ----- Original Message ---- From: Mike Frels snip'd most BTW I have acquired this summer time problem since I switched to LS1 injectors last year. From bill.washington at nec.com.au Thu Jul 12 19:59:19 2007 From: bill.washington at nec.com.au (Bill Washington) Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 10:59:19 +1000 Subject: [Diy_efi] Warm Start Problem In-Reply-To: <20070712170010.608823B6A6@ns2.nec.com.au> References: <20070712170010.608823B6A6@ns2.nec.com.au> Message-ID: <4696CE67.5060806@nec.com.au> Mike, To me this sounds reminiscent of a heat soak/fuel vaporisation problem. I would look at fuel distribution manifold temp, and also your low and high pressure pumps - if your high volume/low pressure pump (often in tank) has died the high pressure pump may not be able to supply enough fuel flow to clear a vapour lock in the manifold. I had a problem where the engine would cut out on a hot day on the highway if the fuel tank was below 1/3 full - in the city, no problems, more fuel in the tank, no problems - the entire commutator on the low pressure pump had worn away! - I replaced the pump, problem solved! Good luck Bill > > Subject: > [Diy_efi] Warm start problem... > From: > Mike Frels > Date: > Wed, 11 Jul 2007 18:28:14 -0600 (GMT-06:00) > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org, gmecm at diy-efi.org > > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org, gmecm at diy-efi.org > CC: > > > I am trying to diagnose a hot or warm start problem. I've got a gm TPI 350 running $8D for a 305 that has been modded to work with my setup. Morning starts she fires right up. Hot starts if she's only been sitting for less than 10-15 minutes also fine. A restart between 15 minutes to 5 hours sitting takes some cranking. Looking through my tables I've got various Start Up Enrichment and Crank Fuel Pulse Width settings that I am thinking I need to adjust. Can someone enlighten me on what the differences between Start Up Enrichment and Crank Fuel Pulse Width? BTW I have acquired this summer time problem since I switched to LS1 injectors last year. > > Mike > > From g_alan_e at yahoo.com Sun Jul 15 19:13:45 2007 From: g_alan_e at yahoo.com (Gregg Eshelman) Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 17:13:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] Warm Start Problem In-Reply-To: <4696CE67.5060806@nec.com.au> Message-ID: <493692.37728.qm@web50301.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Bill Washington wrote: > Mike, > To me this sounds reminiscent of a heat > soak/fuel vaporisation problem. > I would look at fuel distribution manifold temp, and > also your low and > high pressure pumps - if your high volume/low > pressure pump (often in > tank) has died the high pressure pump may not be > able to supply enough > fuel flow to clear a vapour lock in the manifold. Most vehicles with EFI use the fuel to cool the in-tank pump. Running around a lot with 1/4 tank or less can lead to an overheated pump. Some cars have an open-cell foam sleeve around the pump to wick fuel up for cooling when the level is low but many just use something like a corrugated "rubber" ring to hold a small amount around the pump. It vaporises then the pump gets hot until you make a hard enough turn to slosh fuel over the pump. It's expensive these days to keep the tank at least half full, but it'll save the annoyance of having your pump quit in the middle of nowhere- or the middle of a busy intersection downtown. P.S. What's weird is so many about-to-quit pumps will conk out right after you fill the tank completely full... dunno why but that's when every one of the EFI pumps I've had fail has chosen to fail. That's also happened to the majority of the people I know who've had a pump quit. Maximizes the annoyance factor of Murphy's Law! ____________________________________________________________________________________ Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz From bill.washington at nec.com.au Mon Jul 16 19:18:48 2007 From: bill.washington at nec.com.au (Bill Washington) Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 10:18:48 +1000 Subject: [Diy_efi] Warm start problem In-Reply-To: <20070716170018.AB50737742@ns1.nec.com.au> References: <20070716170018.AB50737742@ns1.nec.com.au> Message-ID: <469C0AE8.9090104@nec.com.au> Greg, In my case I do not know when the pump died, but when I removed it the copper on the commutator was completely worn away - how it had run that long I do not know! Also in my case the high pressure pump was able to draw sufficient fuel from the tank most of the time the crunch was: hot weather + sustained Highway speeds (one hour +) + low fuel in the tank ..... remove any one of those variables and everything worked fine! ie the problem occurred mid afternoon, but by late afternoon when the temperature had dropped 5 degrees the problem went away.......likewise, slow down, or fill the tank and the problem was not observed .... Bill > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Warm Start Problem (Gregg Eshelman) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: > Re: [Diy_efi] Warm Start Problem > From: > Gregg Eshelman > Date: > Sun, 15 Jul 2007 17:13:45 -0700 (PDT) > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > > --- Bill Washington > wrote: > > >> Mike, >> To me this sounds reminiscent of a heat >> soak/fuel vaporisation problem. >> I would look at fuel distribution manifold temp, and >> also your low and >> high pressure pumps - if your high volume/low >> pressure pump (often in >> tank) has died the high pressure pump may not be >> able to supply enough >> fuel flow to clear a vapour lock in the manifold. >> > > Most vehicles with EFI use the fuel to cool the > in-tank pump. Running around a lot with 1/4 tank or > less can lead to an overheated pump. Some cars have > an open-cell foam sleeve around the pump to wick fuel > up for cooling when the level is low but many just > use something like a corrugated "rubber" ring to > hold a small amount around the pump. It vaporises > then the pump gets hot until you make a hard enough > turn to slosh fuel over the pump. > > It's expensive these days to keep the tank at least > half full, but it'll save the annoyance of having > your pump quit in the middle of nowhere- or the > middle of a busy intersection downtown. > > P.S. What's weird is so many about-to-quit pumps > will conk out right after you fill the tank completely > full... dunno why but that's when every one of the > EFI pumps I've had fail has chosen to fail. That's > also happened to the majority of the people I know > who've had a pump quit. Maximizes the annoyance factor > of Murphy's Law! > > > From Steve.Ravet at arm.com Thu Jul 19 21:50:51 2007 From: Steve.Ravet at arm.com (Steve Ravet) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 19:50:51 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Message-ID: By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab last year for a pump house (had only ever done fence posts previously) and was pleasantly surprised at how it turned out, but that size can be screeded with a 12' board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm building a steel building workshop this summer and am contemplating pouring this slab myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but not sure if I'll be able to get a good machined finish. Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some friends? thanks, --steve ------------------- Steve Ravet ARM steve.ravet at arm.com -- IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. From bernie at innovative.iinet.net.au Thu Jul 19 22:36:17 2007 From: bernie at innovative.iinet.net.au (Bernd Felsche) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 11:36:17 +0800 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200707201136.17786@death.2.spammers> On Friday 20 July 2007 10:50, Steve Ravet wrote: > By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab last year for a pump > house (had only ever done fence posts previously) and was pleasantly > surprised at how it turned out, but that size can be screeded with a 12' > board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm building a steel > building workshop this summer and am contemplating pouring this slab > myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but not sure if I'll be > able to get a good machined finish. > Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some friends? I'd hesitate; not only because I'm lazy but because the size means that you'll either have to get a slow-setting mix (i.e. no "accelerants" (catalysts)) or work very hard for a couple of hours. I recently had a garage-workshop (~3m by 9m) built and the professional who did the concrete floor was sweating heavily through most of it ... at ambient temperatures below 10 degrees C; wearing a light shirt and short trousers. It's going to take a lot of cold beer to keep your friends cool. As an aside, seeing that it's a steel workshop, it would be well worth your while to insulate walls and roof with insulating blanket. The bubble-wrap style of reflective insulation is only good with still air around it, so steer away from that and towards the glass-wool on heavy, reinforced aluminium foil. Such blankets come in rolls and are sandwiched between the steel frame and the steel exterior (wall and roof). The interior will be shiny aluminium that can be left exposed unless there's the likelihood of mechanical damage to the foil itself... in which case some form of lining can be attached to the frame in such locations. Besides heat, the blankets also reduce noise; not only transmitted through the walls, but that reflected off the walls from sources inside the workshop. So nobody will be able to e.g. hear your obscenities as the screwdriver slips off a hose clamp and pierces the webbing between thumb and index finger on your left hand. -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | The object of life is not to be on the side of X against HTML mail | the majority but to escape finding oneself in / \ and postings | the ranks of the insane. -- Marcus Aurelius From ebuckler at icehouse.net Fri Jul 20 00:37:12 2007 From: ebuckler at icehouse.net (Ernest Buckler) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:37:12 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? References: Message-ID: <01c301c7ca90$06322740$0300a8c0@userc276844d8d> Steve, Can you pour it in two sections, each less than the 14' screed board width? Depends on how far your delivery truck has to travel, but that sounds like two loads anyway, right? So no skin off their nose if you pour twice, a week apart. You could rent the finishing whaddayacallit with rotating flat blades - but I'd like a pro to at least coach that part. BTW, a clever friend did his floor recently with in the floor heating using household hot water heater and reg. indl. valving, works v. well despite dire warnings that such equipment wouldn't stand up to rigors or provide adequate heat. No blowing air, just slightest hum from the low-hp pumps (out and in; only one needed but he's an overkill kinda guy). Next he plans to add solar for sunny winter days. He detailed his own system but said there were precedents for aspects of it on the home eco news sites. Ernest ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Ravet" To: Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2007 7:50 PM Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab last year for a pump house (had only ever done fence posts previously) and was pleasantly surprised at how it turned out, but that size can be screeded with a 12' board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm building a steel building workshop this summer and am contemplating pouring this slab myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but not sure if I'll be able to get a good machined finish. Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some friends? thanks, --steve ------------------- Steve Ravet ARM steve.ravet at arm.com -- IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.9/907 - Release Date: 7/18/2007 3:30 PM From galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 20 01:07:25 2007 From: galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com (J M) Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 23:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: <200707201136.17786@death.2.spammers> Message-ID: <772571.12702.qm@web57307.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Most rental yards will have 3 foot aluminum skreeds with extension handles. Helps get a nice finish. Start with a straight board to get the concrete close to level, then use the skreed with long handles to smooth it out. You'd probably want 3-4 guys. One with a shovel pushing concrete as it comes out of the truck. Second guy to start with the board. Third guy to do the final skreed work. --- Bernd Felsche wrote: > On Friday 20 July 2007 10:50, Steve Ravet wrote: > > By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab > last year for a pump > > house (had only ever done fence posts previously) > and was pleasantly > > surprised at how it turned out, but that size can > be screeded with a 12' > > board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm > building a steel > > building workshop this summer and am contemplating > pouring this slab > > myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but > not sure if I'll be > > able to get a good machined finish. > > > Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some > friends? > > I'd hesitate; not only because I'm lazy but because > the size means > that you'll either have to get a slow-setting mix > (i.e. no > "accelerants" (catalysts)) or work very hard for a > couple of hours. > I recently had a garage-workshop (~3m by 9m) built > and the > professional who did the concrete floor was sweating > heavily through > most of it ... at ambient temperatures below 10 > degrees C; wearing a > light shirt and short trousers. > > It's going to take a lot of cold beer to keep your > friends cool. > > As an aside, seeing that it's a steel workshop, it > would be well > worth your while to insulate walls and roof with > insulating blanket. > > The bubble-wrap style of reflective insulation is > only good with > still air around it, so steer away from that and > towards the > glass-wool on heavy, reinforced aluminium foil. Such > blankets come > in rolls and are sandwiched between the steel frame > and the steel > exterior (wall and roof). The interior will be shiny > aluminium that > can be left exposed unless there's the likelihood of > mechanical > damage to the foil itself... in which case some form > of lining can > be attached to the frame in such locations. > > Besides heat, the blankets also reduce noise; not > only transmitted > through the walls, but that reflected off the walls > from sources > inside the workshop. So nobody will be able to e.g. > hear your > obscenities as the screwdriver slips off a hose > clamp and pierces > the webbing between thumb and index finger on your > left hand. > > -- > /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, > Western Australia > \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | The object of life is > not to be on the side of > X against HTML mail | the majority but to > escape finding oneself in > / \ and postings | the ranks of the > insane. -- Marcus Aurelius > > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: > http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 From mfrels at ix.netcom.com Fri Jul 20 06:41:51 2007 From: mfrels at ix.netcom.com (Mike Frels) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 06:41:51 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Message-ID: <23702451.1184931712034.JavaMail.root@elwamui-rustique.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I'd be more leaning toward paying for an experienced contractor and the experienced helpers that they usually come with. A pour that large would quite costly in the event of an "ooops!" for somebody that has no past experience dealing with them. If you were to try to do it by yourself and a few buddies I would want most of them to have at least one or two previous pours experience. My .02, Mike -----Original Message----- >From: Bernd Felsche >Sent: Jul 19, 2007 10:36 PM >To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? > >On Friday 20 July 2007 10:50, Steve Ravet wrote: >> By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab last year for a pump >> house (had only ever done fence posts previously) and was pleasantly >> surprised at how it turned out, but that size can be screeded with a 12' >> board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm building a steel >> building workshop this summer and am contemplating pouring this slab >> myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but not sure if I'll be >> able to get a good machined finish. > >> Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some friends? > >I'd hesitate; not only because I'm lazy but because the size means >that you'll either have to get a slow-setting mix (i.e. no >"accelerants" (catalysts)) or work very hard for a couple of hours. >I recently had a garage-workshop (~3m by 9m) built and the >professional who did the concrete floor was sweating heavily through >most of it ... at ambient temperatures below 10 degrees C; wearing a >light shirt and short trousers. > >It's going to take a lot of cold beer to keep your friends cool. > From b.shaw at comcast.net Fri Jul 20 09:31:24 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 10:31:24 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <46A0C73C.4080809@comcast.net> I did a 24x32 floating slab (14 1/2 yards of concrete) for my garage a few years back with the help of my brother. It took about 6 hours after the pour to finish up. We rented bull floats and a power float to finish. One section of the form moved a about 2" so the front edge isn't perfectly straight, and water flows off to the side in one bay, but all in all it worked out well. Five years or so and no cracks with a 2 story 'cape' type structure on it. Next time I would start earlier (we started after work), add a little more reinforcement to the form, and have a couple more friends. hth, Bill 84 928s 5.0L Vortech/749 (almost driveable!) Steve Ravet wrote: > By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab last year for a pump > house (had only ever done fence posts previously) and was pleasantly > surprised at how it turned out, but that size can be screeded with a 12' > board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm building a steel > building workshop this summer and am contemplating pouring this slab > myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but not sure if I'll be > able to get a good machined finish. Is this too big a project for a > DIYer and some friends? > > thanks, > --steve > > ------------------- > Steve Ravet > ARM > steve.ravet at arm.com > > From dunvegan at sbcglobal.net Fri Jul 20 10:49:40 2007 From: dunvegan at sbcglobal.net (Rick McLeod) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 08:49:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Message-ID: <860241.91675.qm@web80507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I think you're confusing screed w/ float. ----- Original Message ---- From: J M To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Sent: Friday, July 20, 2007 1:07:25 AM Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Most rental yards will have 3 foot aluminum skreeds with extension handles. Helps get a nice finish. Start with a straight board to get the concrete close to level, then use the skreed with long handles to smooth it out. You'd probably want 3-4 guys. One with a shovel pushing concrete as it comes out of the truck. Second guy to start with the board. Third guy to do the final skreed work. --- Bernd Felsche wrote: > On Friday 20 July 2007 10:50, Steve Ravet wrote: > > By large, I mean 25'x45'? I poured a 10x20 slab > last year for a pump > > house (had only ever done fence posts previously) > and was pleasantly > > surprised at how it turned out, but that size can > be screeded with a 12' > > board, and a hand troweled finish was fine. I'm > building a steel > > building workshop this summer and am contemplating > pouring this slab > > myself. I'm OK with the forms and the steel, but > not sure if I'll be > > able to get a good machined finish. > > > Is this too big a project for a DIYer and some > friends? > > I'd hesitate; not only because I'm lazy but because > the size means > that you'll either have to get a slow-setting mix > (i.e. no > "accelerants" (catalysts)) or work very hard for a > couple of hours. > I recently had a garage-workshop (~3m by 9m) built > and the > professional who did the concrete floor was sweating > heavily through > most of it ... at ambient temperatures below 10 > degrees C; wearing a > light shirt and short trousers. > > It's going to take a lot of cold beer to keep your > friends cool. > > As an aside, seeing that it's a steel workshop, it > would be well > worth your while to insulate walls and roof with > insulating blanket. > > The bubble-wrap style of reflective insulation is > only good with > still air around it, so steer away from that and > towards the > glass-wool on heavy, reinforced aluminium foil. Such > blankets come > in rolls and are sandwiched between the steel frame > and the steel > exterior (wall and roof). The interior will be shiny > aluminium that > can be left exposed unless there's the likelihood of > mechanical > damage to the foil itself... in which case some form > of lining can > be attached to the frame in such locations. > > Besides heat, the blankets also reduce noise; not > only transmitted > through the walls, but that reflected off the walls > from sources > inside the workshop. So nobody will be able to e.g. > hear your > obscenities as the screwdriver slips off a hose > clamp and pierces > the webbing between thumb and index finger on your > left hand. > > -- > /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, > Western Australia > \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | The object of life is > not to be on the side of > X against HTML mail | the majority but to > escape finding oneself in > / \ and postings | the ranks of the > insane. -- Marcus Aurelius > > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: > http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From bearbvd at mindspring.com Fri Jul 20 11:40:27 2007 From: bearbvd at mindspring.com (bearbvd at mindspring.com) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 12:40:27 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Message-ID: <380-220077520164027953@M2W045.mail2web.com> Original Message: ----------------- From: Rick McLeod dunvegan at sbcglobal.net Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 08:49:40 -0700 (PDT) To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? I think you're confusing screed w/ float. First of all--decent floats are Mag, not Al. The cement reacts differently to Mag than Al. Second--if you're going to a rental yard, rent a Mag screed bar as WELL as a Mag float. The finish will come out MUCH better if the right tools are used. Also--recommend NEVER using a 'jitterbug'--the mesh, expanded metal thing, flat or on a roller, used to push the large aggregate a bit below the surface. If a slab is jitterbugged, ESPECIALLY in a cold climate, it is FAR more likely that the surface will 'spall' later. (Spalling = chunks of surface flaking off.) Greg Greg -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web LIVE ? Free email based on Microsoft? Exchange technology - http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE From b.shaw at comcast.net Fri Jul 20 11:52:57 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 12:52:57 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 - tps Message-ID: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> Hi All, My tps is reading from 0 to 78%. Does the ecm scale this reading or am I only going to get 3/4 power out of my engine? Bill 84 928s 5.0L Vortech/749 From b.shaw at comcast.net Fri Jul 20 12:03:12 2007 From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 13:03:12 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 - tps In-Reply-To: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> References: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> Message-ID: <46A0EAD0.9060705@comcast.net> BTW - the throttle is operating to the ends of its mechanical stops, the cable is adjusted so that off the throttle is fully closed against the idle adjust screw, and on the floor just barely bumps the mechanical WOT stop on the throttle body. I've adjusted it so that the '749 sees 26% at idle and 99% at WOT, but the computer fixes that so it reads 0 at idle again. Bill Bill Shaw wrote: > Hi All, > > My tps is reading from 0 to 78%. Does the ecm scale this reading or > am I only going to get 3/4 power out of my engine? > > Bill > 84 928s 5.0L Vortech/749 > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > From tmc_mike_yates at sbcglobal.net Fri Jul 20 12:12:52 2007 From: tmc_mike_yates at sbcglobal.net (Mike Yates) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 10:12:52 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 - tps In-Reply-To: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> References: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> Message-ID: <82r1a3h2knp7ocdd4chgddf37r4iql39ed@4ax.com> is there no way you could compare the output voltage at WOT to the voltage reference for wot on your map? i don't believe the 3/4 equation quite works out since at the end of the day the TB is open reguardless of what the ecu thinks...so as long as your a/f and timing are ok then it should be all G...except for the possibility of not using the entire map scale. On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 12:52:57 -0400, you wrote: >Hi All, > >My tps is reading from 0 to 78%. Does the ecm scale this reading or am >I only going to get 3/4 power out of my engine? > >Bill >84 928s 5.0L Vortech/749 >_______________________________________________ >Diy_efi mailing list >Diy_efi at diy-efi.org >Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi >Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi From galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 20 13:35:10 2007 From: galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com (J M) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 11:35:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: <860241.91675.qm@web80507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <583230.27705.qm@web57307.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Yes, you are correct. --- Rick McLeod wrote: > I think you're confusing screed w/ float. > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: J M > > Most rental yards will have 3 foot aluminum skreeds > with extension handles. Helps get a nice finish. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469 From Steve.Ravet at arm.com Fri Jul 20 13:57:12 2007 From: Steve.Ravet at arm.com (Steve Ravet) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 11:57:12 -0700 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: <380-220077520164027953@M2W045.mail2web.com> Message-ID: I had some spalling on the 10x20 slab I did last year but didn't use anything like what you described. Just screed, 3' float, then hand trowel. What causes the spalling? I think I've decided to do the forms myself and hire the concrete work. Or at least to call and get estimates. How about epoxy or other floor finishes? Anyone used them in a garage? BTW the final plans include enough space to park 2 cars end to end, with the furthest back space having a 4 post Eagle lift. Can't wait to have it all set up :-) --steve > -----Original Message----- > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org > [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of > bearbvd at mindspring.com > Sent: Friday, July 20, 2007 11:40 AM > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? > > > > Original Message: > ----------------- > From: Rick McLeod dunvegan at sbcglobal.net > Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 08:49:40 -0700 (PDT) > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? > > > I think you're confusing screed w/ float. > > > First of all--decent floats are Mag, not Al. The cement > reacts differently to Mag than Al. > > Second--if you're going to a rental yard, rent a Mag screed > bar as WELL as a Mag float. > > The finish will come out MUCH better if the right tools are used. > > Also--recommend NEVER using a 'jitterbug'--the mesh, expanded > metal thing, flat or on a roller, used to push the large > aggregate a bit below the surface. If a slab is jitterbugged, > ESPECIALLY in a cold climate, it is FAR more likely that the > surface will 'spall' later. (Spalling = chunks of surface > flaking off.) > > Greg > > Greg > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > mail2web LIVE - Free email based on Microsoft(r) Exchange > technology - http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE > > > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > -- IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. From galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 20 20:50:14 2007 From: galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com (J M) Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:50:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <757141.18595.qm@web57303.mail.re1.yahoo.com> We just put new epoxy on the floors of the student projects building at Ohio state. Very nice. Much easier to clean up the floors/keep dust down when we paint or do carbon fiber work. Jason http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B04yzmGnvx0 --- Steve Ravet wrote: > I had some spalling on the 10x20 slab I did last > year but didn't use > anything like what you described. Just screed, 3' > float, then hand > trowel. What causes the spalling? > > I think I've decided to do the forms myself and hire > the concrete work. > Or at least to call and get estimates. > > How about epoxy or other floor finishes? Anyone > used them in a garage? > > BTW the final plans include enough space to park 2 > cars end to end, with > the furthest back space having a 4 post Eagle lift. > Can't wait to have > it all set up :-) > > --steve > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow From bearbvd at mindspring.com Sun Jul 22 12:04:30 2007 From: bearbvd at mindspring.com (bearbvd at mindspring.com) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 13:04:30 -0400 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? Message-ID: <380-22007702217430535@M2W009.mail2web.com> Original Message: ----------------- From: J M galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:50:14 -0700 (PDT) To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? We just put new epoxy on the floors of the student projects building at Ohio state. Very nice. Much easier to clean up the floors/keep dust down when we paint or do carbon fiber work. Jason http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B04yzmGnvx0 --- Steve Ravet wrote: > I had some spalling on the 10x20 slab I did last > year but didn't use > anything like what you described. Just screed, 3' > float, then hand > trowel. What causes the spalling? Adding too much (generally ANY) water to the mix before pouring, not enough cement in the mix (never use less than six sack for flat work). Also-- if the slab was poured under hot sunny, or windy conditions--the surface may not have cured decently. > > I think I've decided to do the forms myself and hire > the concrete work. > Or at least to call and get estimates. > > How about epoxy or other floor finishes? Anyone > used them in a garage? THE very best finish is 'Lumi-Plate'. The second best is 'Master-Plate'. Both are dry-cast, trowel in products. (Spread 'em on the surface after screeding, before troweling.) Each will make the surface four to eight times harder than it would otherwise be. Each of these uses steel filings as aggregate, Lumi-Plate uses stainless filings--so , for a wet environment, Lumi-Plate is the way to go. It also gives a much brighter surface, hence the name. A spray-on, membrane forming curing compound ALSO helps the cure/strength a LOT. You can also accomplish this the old fashioned way-- lay burlap over the surface and keep it wet for a week to a month--- Apply sealer ('silane' is good) or paint/epoxy as desired. Any surface coating is ONLY as good as the concrete under it !!! A sheet of (6 mil thick) visquene over the gravel under the slab will GREATLY improve the cure and consequently the strength of a slab. Beware--a LOT of finisher will claim otherwise, this is BS. Without the plastic underneath, the gravel pulls a lot of the water out of the concrete, quickly. This is BAD for the cure, but also make it 'go off' much faster--thus letting the finishers get their work done and go home sooner !! Greg > > BTW the final plans include enough space to park 2 > cars end to end, with > the furthest back space having a 4 post Eagle lift. > Can't wait to have > it all set up :-) > > --steve > ____________________________________________________________________________ ________ Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow _______________________________________________ Diy_efi mailing list Diy_efi at diy-efi.org Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web.com ? What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you? http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint From bill.washington at nec.com.au Sun Jul 22 20:42:08 2007 From: bill.washington at nec.com.au (Bill Washington) Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 11:42:08 +1000 Subject: [Diy_efi] Warm start problem In-Reply-To: <20070716170018.AB50737742@ns1.nec.com.au> References: <20070716170018.AB50737742@ns1.nec.com.au> Message-ID: <46A40770.3070404@nec.com.au> Greg, In my case I do not know when the pump died, but when I removed it the copper on the commutator was completely worn away - how it had run that long I do not know! Also in my case the high pressure pump was able to draw sufficient fuel from the tank most of the time the crunch was: hot weather + sustained Highway speeds (one hour +) + low fuel in the tank ..... remove any one of those variables and everything worked fine! ie the problem occurred mid afternoon, but by late afternoon when the temperature had dropped 5 degrees the problem went away.......likewise, slow down, or fill the tank and the problem was not observed .... Bill > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Warm Start Problem (Gregg Eshelman) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: > Re: [Diy_efi] Warm Start Problem > From: > Gregg Eshelman > Date: > Sun, 15 Jul 2007 17:13:45 -0700 (PDT) > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > > --- Bill Washington > wrote: > > >> Mike, >> To me this sounds reminiscent of a heat >> soak/fuel vaporisation problem. >> I would look at fuel distribution manifold temp, and >> also your low and >> high pressure pumps - if your high volume/low >> pressure pump (often in >> tank) has died the high pressure pump may not be >> able to supply enough >> fuel flow to clear a vapour lock in the manifold. >> > > Most vehicles with EFI use the fuel to cool the > in-tank pump. Running around a lot with 1/4 tank or > less can lead to an overheated pump. Some cars have > an open-cell foam sleeve around the pump to wick fuel > up for cooling when the level is low but many just > use something like a corrugated "rubber" ring to > hold a small amount around the pump. It vaporises > then the pump gets hot until you make a hard enough > turn to slosh fuel over the pump. > > It's expensive these days to keep the tank at least > half full, but it'll save the annoyance of having > your pump quit in the middle of nowhere- or the > middle of a busy intersection downtown. > > P.S. What's weird is so many about-to-quit pumps > will conk out right after you fill the tank completely > full... dunno why but that's when every one of the > EFI pumps I've had fail has chosen to fail. That's > also happened to the majority of the people I know > who've had a pump quit. Maximizes the annoyance factor > of Murphy's Law! > > > From bill.washington at nec.com.au Mon Jul 23 18:57:40 2007 From: bill.washington at nec.com.au (Bill Washington) Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2007 09:57:40 +1000 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: <20070723170016.A7F063B6B2@ns2.nec.com.au> References: <20070723170016.A7F063B6B2@ns2.nec.com.au> Message-ID: <46A54074.5010507@nec.com.au> Steve, Is "BONDCRETE" made by the company Sealwell available in the States? My father was a builder and almost always added Bondcrete to the mix when he was pouring a slab - I never saw one of his slabs spall, crack or break up. When a slab is poured in sections he also painted extra (neat) Bondcrete on the first section at the join face before pouring the second section to help bond the two sections together. As an aside, Bondcrete is also an excellent waterproof timber glue! Regards Bill > > Original Message: > ----------------- > From: J M galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com > Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:50:14 -0700 (PDT) > To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? > > > We just put new epoxy on the floors of the student > projects building at Ohio state. Very nice. Much > easier to clean up the floors/keep dust down when we > paint or do carbon fiber work. > > Jason > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B04yzmGnvx0 > > --- Steve Ravet wrote: > > >> I had some spalling on the 10x20 slab I did last >> year but didn't use >> anything like what you described. Just screed, 3' >> float, then hand >> trowel. What causes the spalling? >> > > Adding too much (generally ANY) water to the mix before pouring, not enough > cement in the mix (never use less than six sack for flat work). Also-- if > the slab was poured under hot sunny, or windy conditions--the surface may > not have cured decently. > >> I think I've decided to do the forms myself and hire >> the concrete work. >> Or at least to call and get estimates. >> >> How about epoxy or other floor finishes? Anyone >> used them in a garage? >> > > THE very best finish is 'Lumi-Plate'. The second best is 'Master-Plate'. > Both are dry-cast, trowel in products. (Spread 'em on the surface after > screeding, before troweling.) > Each will make the surface four to eight times harder than it would > otherwise be. > > Each of these uses steel filings as aggregate, Lumi-Plate uses stainless > filings--so , for a wet environment, Lumi-Plate is the way to go. It also > gives a much brighter surface, hence the name. > > A spray-on, membrane forming curing compound ALSO helps the cure/strength a > LOT. You can also accomplish this the old fashioned way-- lay burlap over > the surface and keep it wet for a week to a month--- > > Apply sealer ('silane' is good) or paint/epoxy as desired. Any surface > coating is ONLY as good as the concrete under it !!! > > A sheet of (6 mil thick) visquene over the gravel under the slab will > GREATLY improve the cure and consequently the strength of a slab. Beware--a > LOT of finisher will claim otherwise, this is BS. Without the plastic > underneath, the gravel pulls a lot of the water out of the concrete, > quickly. This is BAD for the cure, but also make it 'go off' much > faster--thus letting the finishers get their work done and go home sooner !! > > Greg > > > >> BTW the final plans include enough space to park 2 >> cars end to end, with >> the furthest back space having a 4 post Eagle lift. >> Can't wait to have >> it all set up :-) >> >> --steve >> >> > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > ________ > Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated > for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. > http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > mail2web.com -- What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you? > http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint > > From niche at iinet.net.au Mon Jul 23 22:52:47 2007 From: niche at iinet.net.au (Mike) Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2007 11:52:47 +0800 Subject: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? In-Reply-To: <46A54074.5010507@nec.com.au> References: <20070723170016.A7F063B6B2@ns2.nec.com.au> <46A54074.5010507@nec.com.au> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.0.20070724114928.02784ca0@iinet.net.au>> Sounds a bit like the PVDC that has been used in the marine industry, PolyVinylideneChloride however cures at higher temp but is an extremely good moisture and oxygen barrier also used in food industry but bit pricey at $80/L. It comes as an aqueous emulsion, apply it and place under IR lamp so cures at approx 45degC, now used as non toxic, non flammble copolymer coating for circuit boards where they are likely to encounter splash such as in irrigation controls etc, rgds mike At 07:57 AM 7/24/07, you wrote: >Steve, > Is "BONDCRETE" made by the company Sealwell available in the States? >My father was a builder and almost always added Bondcrete to the mix when he was pouring a slab - I never saw one of his slabs spall, crack or break up. >When a slab is poured in sections he also painted extra (neat) Bondcrete on the first section at the join face before pouring the second section to help bond the two sections together. > As an aside, Bondcrete is also an excellent waterproof timber glue! > >Regards >Bill > >> >>Original Message: >>----------------- >>From: J M galaxiecustom500 at yahoo.com >>Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:50:14 -0700 (PDT) >>To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org >>Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? >> >> >>We just put new epoxy on the floors of the student >>projects building at Ohio state. Very nice. Much >>easier to clean up the floors/keep dust down when we >>paint or do carbon fiber work. >> >>Jason >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B04yzmGnvx0 >> >>--- Steve Ravet wrote: >> >> >>>I had some spalling on the 10x20 slab I did last >>>year but didn't use >>>anything like what you described. Just screed, 3' >>>float, then hand >>>trowel. What causes the spalling? >>> >> >>Adding too much (generally ANY) water to the mix before pouring, not enough >>cement in the mix (never use less than six sack for flat work). Also-- if >>the slab was poured under hot sunny, or windy conditions--the surface may >>not have cured decently. >> >>>I think I've decided to do the forms myself and hire >>>the concrete work. >>>Or at least to call and get estimates. >>> >>>How about epoxy or other floor finishes? Anyone >>>used them in a garage? >>> >> >>THE very best finish is 'Lumi-Plate'. The second best is 'Master-Plate'. >>Both are dry-cast, trowel in products. (Spread 'em on the surface after >>screeding, before troweling.) >>Each will make the surface four to eight times harder than it would >>otherwise be. >> >>Each of these uses steel filings as aggregate, Lumi-Plate uses stainless >>filings--so , for a wet environment, Lumi-Plate is the way to go. It also >>gives a much brighter surface, hence the name. >> >>A spray-on, membrane forming curing compound ALSO helps the cure/strength a >>LOT. You can also accomplish this the old fashioned way-- lay burlap over >>the surface and keep it wet for a week to a month--- >> >>Apply sealer ('silane' is good) or paint/epoxy as desired. Any surface >>coating is ONLY as good as the concrete under it !!! >> >>A sheet of (6 mil thick) visquene over the gravel under the slab will >>GREATLY improve the cure and consequently the strength of a slab. Beware--a >>LOT of finisher will claim otherwise, this is BS. Without the plastic >>underneath, the gravel pulls a lot of the water out of the concrete, >>quickly. This is BAD for the cure, but also make it 'go off' much >>faster--thus letting the finishers get their work done and go home sooner !! >> >>Greg >> >> >> >>>BTW the final plans include enough space to park 2 >>>cars end to end, with >>>the furthest back space having a 4 post Eagle lift. Can't wait to have >>>it all set up :-) >>> >>>--steve >>> >>> >> >> >> >>____________________________________________________________________________ >>________ >>Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated >>for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. >>http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow >>_______________________________________________ >>Diy_efi mailing list >>Diy_efi at diy-efi.org >>Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi >>Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi >> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------- >>mail2web.com -- What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you? >>http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint >> >> >_______________________________________________ >Diy_efi mailing list >Diy_efi at diy-efi.org >Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi >Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi Regards from Mike Perth, Western Australia VK/VL Commodore Fuse Rail panel that wont warp, twist or melt, guaranteed ! Twin tyres for most sedans, trikes and motorcycle sidecars http://niche.iinet.net.au From bill.washington at nec.com.au Tue Jul 24 20:24:48 2007 From: bill.washington at nec.com.au (Bill Washington) Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2007 11:24:48 +1000 Subject: [Diy_efi] Re: Diy_efi Digest, Vol 29, Issue 16 In-Reply-To: <20070724170019.C30903B6A2@ns2.nec.com.au> References: <20070724170019.C30903B6A2@ns2.nec.com.au> Message-ID: <46A6A660.7050301@nec.com.au> Mike, I don't know what chemicals they use in Bondcrete, but is much cheaper than $80/l - in its liquid form it looks like a white wood glue - like Selleys Aquadhere, but dries waterproof - it waterproofs the slab as well as acting as a bonding agent, and is readily available in most hardware stores in Aus - Bunnings, Mitre 10 ... etc One correction to my previous email - Sealwell has been bought out or otherwise changed its name to 'bondall' website is Regards Bill > > Subject: > RE: [Diy_efi] ever poured a large slab? > From: > "Mike" > Date: > Tue, 24 Jul 2007 11:52:47 +0800 > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > To: > diy_efi at diy-efi.org > > > Sounds a bit like the PVDC that has been used in the marine industry, > PolyVinylideneChloride however cures at higher temp but is > an extremely good moisture and oxygen barrier also used in > food industry but bit pricey at $80/L. It comes as an aqueous emulsion, > apply it and place under IR lamp so cures at approx 45degC, > now used as non toxic, non flammble copolymer coating for > circuit boards where they are likely to encounter splash such > as in irrigation controls etc, > > rgds > > mike > > > g/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > From wopontour at hotmail.com Wed Jul 25 19:43:43 2007 From: wopontour at hotmail.com (WopOnTour) Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2007 18:43:43 -0600 Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 - tps References: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> Message-ID: Bill Some scan devices will show 78% at WOT if your scan tool is using SAE TP angle on some calibrations. WOT ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Shaw" To: Sent: Friday, July 20, 2007 10:52 AM Subject: [Diy_efi] 749 - tps > Hi All, > > My tps is reading from 0 to 78%. Does the ecm scale this reading or am I > only going to get 3/4 power out of my engine? > > Bill > 84 928s 5.0L Vortech/749 > _______________________________________________ > Diy_efi mailing list > Diy_efi at diy-efi.org > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/diy_efi > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi > From wopontour at hotmail.com Mon Jul 30 00:21:20 2007 From: wopontour at hotmail.com (WopOnTour) Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 23:21:20 -0600 Subject: [Diy_efi] 1227727 is the same as a 1227730 ?? References: <46A0E869.306@comcast.net> Message-ID: Seen this on eBay http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=220133490178 Can anyone confirm that a 1227727 is the same as a 1227730 ? Can I just splice in the new connectors and use my AZTY bin with a 27C256 ? Thanks WOT