RE: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System

[Mike Rolica <mrolica@meridian-mag.com>]

Like bruce said try the module.  In the dizzy  For some reason the modules
seem to fry in the dissy with msd and all the time with cranes..  acltully
with the msd you can rip out the module and hook the msd straight to the
pickup.  Msd also offers a conversion cap to make large dizzys ext coil.
Mike Rolica
Meridian Magnesium Products
Strathroy, Ont 
Ext. 260


	-----Original Message-----
	From:	Mark Romans [SMTP:romans@pacbell.net]
	Sent:	Tuesday, January 11, 2000 12:39 AM
	To:	gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
	Subject:	Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System

	I've got a MSD6AL, with Accell coil in cap. MSD box is hidden under
the
	battery box.
	It stalled on me 3x today.  All at idle or on deceleration.
Restarts fine.
	Mark
	-----Original Message-----
	From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
	To: gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
<gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>
	Date: Monday, January 10, 2000 9:36 PM
	Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System


	>Ahh, get a MSD low resistance center bushing, and a good
aftermarket coil.
	>MSD makes a kit for using a remote coil.
	>  Better yet get a late model small cap distributor, and use a good
coil
	>with that.
	>Then might even use a good spark box.
	>  I know not oem looking then, but worth it, IMHO.
	>Using a remote coil late dissy, I have 230K miles on the original
	>module........
	>Grmpy
	>
	>
	>
	>| Sorry Bruce:  Forgot to answer, large cap dizzy!
	>| Mark
	>| -----Original Message-----
	>| From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
	>| To: gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
<gmecm@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>
	>| Date: Sunday, January 09, 2000 6:51 PM
	>| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
	>|
	>|
	>| >
	>| >It usually makes the engine surge wildly, when it applies, on
modified
	>| >engines, even mild surge on stockers.
	>| >  The mechanics are opening IAC, and adding fuel.  If bad enough
I think
	>it
	>| >might move the timing.
	>| >Grumpy
	>| >  You might just for grins try uping the BL to a higher number
for the
	>idle
	>| >stall thing.
	>| >
	>| >
	>| >| I just rechecked and 700 rpm's for both GDF files, stall1 and
stall2.
	>I
	>| >| wonder if that has something to do with stall saver rpm's?
	>| >| Next question, what specifically does stall saver do?
	>| >| Mark
	>| >
	>| >| From: Bruce Plecan <nacelp@bright.net>
	>| >| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
	>| >| >| Hey Bruce: If I disconnect my est connector, should I see
the
	>advance
	>| >at
	>| >| >| 2500 rpm?
	>| >| >Yes
	>| >| >| I am wondering if this is why I have the idle problem.
Remember
	how
	>| >the
	>| >| >| signal goes to zero advance?
	>| >| >As I recall it did that during the stall and it was right at
400 rpm,
	>| >which
	>| >| >is when the ecm drops out of bypass, and it would read 0 as I
	>understand
	>| >| >things.
	>| >| >The only failure I've personnally had or diagnosed with a gm
module
	is
	>| >hot
	>| >| >stalling, and progressing to where the engine needs to cool
before it
	>| >would
	>| >| >restart.
	>| >| >BTW, is yours a large or small cap Dissy
	>| >| >Bruce
	>| >| >| Mark
	>| >| >| From: John T. Martin <gmman@eskimo.com>
	>| >| >| Subject: Re: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
	>| >| >| >My  $.02
	>| >| >| >That is a normal condition, also a test for P/U coil
signal
	>strength.
	>| >| The
	>| >| >| >advance is triggered by the P/U coil signal amplitude, not
RPM. It
	>is
	>| >a
	>| >| >| back
	>| >| >| >up as I understand it, but a good test if you suspect a
weak
	magnet
	>| in
	>| >| >the
	>| >| >| >dist. We had a run of K engines with shaft problems a
while back
	>and
	>| >in
	>| >| >| >bypass (est disconnected), 2500 rpm the advance was not
triggered.
	>| >Also
	>| >| >the
	>| >| >| >weak pick-up signal affects idle quality.
	>| >| >| >Subject: Timing Jump on 165/TPI System
	>| >| >| >A question:
	>| >| >| >With timing control connector disconnected (ie. setting
timing on
	a
	>| >| >| >165-based TPI motor), timing should sit still, which it
does for
	me
	>| at
	>| >| >low
	>| >| >| >RPM. However, when I idle it on up to say 2000 or 2500, it
seems
	to
	>| >| >advance
	>| >| >| >like 12 degrees or so, instantaneously, and hold up there
until I
	>| idle
	>| >| it
	>| >| >| >back down. Then it jump-returns to the previous value.
This is all
	>| >| >| >timing-light based. Any thoughts on what is being seen?
There's
	>about
	>| >a
	>| >| >1-3
	>| >| >| >degree drift on idle-up, probably from timing chain
stretch, but
	>| >that's
	>| >| >not
	>| >| >| >huge.
	>| >| >| >Anyways, fishing for thoughts. It's not problematic, just
would
	>like
	>| >to
	>| >| >| >understand what's happening and why.
	>| >| >| >Sincerely,
	>| >| >| >Craig
	>| >
	>| >
	>|
	>